Pope hates violent/sex games...

[SCiARA]

"Any trend to produce programs and products - including animated movies and video games - which in the name of entertainment exalt violence and portray anti-social behaviour or the trivilization of human sexuality is a perversion, all the more repulsive when these programs are directed at children and adolescents," he said.

"I appeal to the leaders of the media industry to educated and encourage producers to safeguard the common good, to uphold the truth, to protect individual human dignity and promote respect for the needs of the family."

Benedict also suggested that children should be encouraged to enjoy classic literature, fine arts and "uplifting music".

I kind of get the feeling he's stereotyping gamers as a bunch of prepubescent kids wanking over manga.

While the jist of what he's saying is correct, i.e. violent/sexual games & animation shouldn’t be seen by kids, I fail to see how this lands in the laps of the "media Industry" Surely that’s a Government thing to put a working age restricting licensing’s on said material and strictly enforce this through retailers?

What next? No more violent/mature films? The banning of all adult material full stop?

[CJX]

I kind of get the feeling he's stereotyping gamers as a bunch of prepubescent kids wanking over manga.

That's what we are, aren't we?

[Jimmy Kruger]

Lol @ the Pope.

I don't even wanna get started on religion. I would only offend someone.

"In the beginning God made man"..... Oh yeah, what about dinosasurs? Where do they fit in?.... Was their dominance over Earth for a few million years not worth a mention??

Vote - Science.

[CJX]

The only difference that matters between science and religion is that science is more open to change, and less apt to war - even if it does provide the means.

[Bob]

"In the beginning God made man"..... Oh yeah, what about dinosasurs? Where do they fit in?.... Was their dominance over Earth for a few million years not worth a mention??

You see the Dinosaur remains are Gods idea of a practical joke. If he made the earth and everything else a few Fossils shouldn't prove too tough should it? If it was easy to believe with scientific proof you wouldn't need faith now would you?

[Jimmy Kruger]

The idea of a God with such a sick sense of humour is not a good one, but a scary one.

I'm sorry, but there is no way of convincing me that your religion is true (I don't mean 'your' as a direct statement to you, Bob. I speak to anyone who would attempt to sell me their religious beliefs).
In a recent book I read, there were quotes along the lines of "Religion merely fills in the gaps which remain unproven by science." This was supported by pointing out that the rising and setting of the sun used to be attributed to Helios. The sea was governed by Poseidon. Fire was the work of Vulcan. Etc Etc Etc. Now science has provided answers for all of the questions surrounding these (previous) mysteries.

Now, I am not saying that I think religion is a bad thing as such. I agree that it is important for people to have 'faith'. It is faith that leads people to believe we are not alone. That our actions, are monitored and that we should hold values for those things which are important.

[Edit] I had typed pages worth of opinion here, but I decided in the end that it was needless. I started to get into the realms of terrorist groups, and my opinion on them. At the end of the day, my strong feelings of atheism are only matched by someone elses strong feelings of faith... And who am I to say I am right and they are wrong. I guess I am just a realist, and seek definative proof rather than fables. Faith is something I assosciate with trust, and I cannot trust that which I cannot see, feel or have proven unto me.

[CJX]

I cannot trust that which I cannot see, feel or have proven unto me.

Which throws out a large portion of scientific theories, such as Quantum Physics and the Big Bang...

(Just looking for some discussion here )

[McLaren Fan]

I cannot trust that which I cannot see, feel or have proven unto me.

Which throws out a large portion of scientific theories, such as Quantum Physics and the Big Bang...

(Just looking for some discussion here )

But thats the good thing about science, all theories are equally valid, until experimental evidence rules things out. Whereas religious belief says 'this is how it is, just because HE/SHE/IT says it is'. OK that is an oversimplification, but the point stands.

If this thread goes on for long, I am digging out my Bill Hicks DVD's to get the snappiest comebacks!

[CJX]

But thats the good thing about science, all theories are equally valid, until experimental evidence rules things out.

That's why I personally am more open to science than religion. Science can accept when it's wrong and move on, whereas religion is stuck somewhere 2000 years ago. Science is about progression and knowledge motivated by interest, Religion (like law, but less open to change) is about control and uniformity motivated by selfish hopes - even if the actions of the religious are not selfish.

I can understand why people are religious, but the reasons are - at base value - selfish (though I'm not saying they are wrong). They want to live forever, they want to be part of something bigger than themselves, they want to fuck a lot of girls in heaven, and blowing up themselves and a lot of girls in real-life will ensure they do. They want to fit in. People are not religious because they want to help people - because you don't have to be religious to do that.

[McLaren Fan]

I don't agree it's all selfish. I think the base root of religion was the point where as a species we became intelligent enouh to ask- Why?

When our simple ancestors found they couldn't explain it they conjured up elaborate deities and forces to explain what they couldn't understand. As these religious beliefs took hold, some found that there were positions of power to be found within these organisations. Henceforth the very structure of the major religions has become one of self interest and protectionism.

Who knows they may be right, many of the large religions refer to each others prophets and deities, and many of the stories are correlated across various texts.

[Jimmy Kruger]

Despite my atheism, I harbour a deep respect for each individual religion for reasons which may be hard to justify. I admire how, in general, people of a religious nature hold great value to the things in life which are often taken for granted. They share a kinship, and unison uncommon in modern, 'God-less' society and preach laws that tend to be directed toward a goal of 'enlightenment', 'peace' or some kind of glorified and purpose-filled life.

People find comfort in the belief that 'there is a God' and through this comfort, they are able to live happy lives without a sense of solitude.

Myself, I find comfort in the 'knowledge' that life as we know it was only made possible by a freak chain of reactions following an event dubbed 'The Big Bang' and that the odds of an inhabitable 'planet' forming were so incomprehensibly minute (let alone the chances of evolution producing a species as complex and unique as homosapien) that we are fortunate beyond belief to even be here.

Unofrtunately, I feel that modern culture does not instill this sense of gratitude and worth into our offspring, and therefore a lack of respect, or even care reigns supreme.

It is for this reason I hold such respect for religions in general because they do promote beliefs and values I myself hold true.... But it seems to me that religious practices (as I undertsand it) tend to impliment these beliefs by force-feeding fables and fabricated stories containing morals.

The fables are often sold as truth and therefore it seems the idea is to 'fool' the person in question into holding these values, by scaring it into them...

i.e - The Ten Commandments:

Ten rules for every person to abide by, lest they be sent to Hell. However, if you do break a rule, you may be able to repent and receive forgiveness for your sins as long as you repenence is genuine (cos God can tell you know!)




Forgive the fact my religious references tend to be more about Christianity than anything.... I base my opinion mostly on this, as i have more of an undertsanding of it that others.

So bored of typing now, and can't even remember what my original point was. I wish I could just resist ever commencing these long winded, talking b0llocks, ramblings of a mad man.... erm, posts.

[Septic]

Well you guys have a point but (here we go I hear you guys think) just take the Quran(the holy book of muslims believed to be the word of God) for example. I'm not here to preach Islam to you guys but I just want to say that there is a great misconception that religion and science are incompatible. In fact, the Quran makes refrences to science plenty of times. In fact, the previous statement is an understatement. In the Quran you will read upon refrences at to the creation of the universe and the biology of the world that were mentioned approximately 1400 years ago that have only been discovered by scientists 50 or 100 years ago. Just go on www.youtube.com and listen to a scholar called Dr Zakir Naik to understand what I am saying. Look especially for the debate of Dr Zakir Naik vs Dr William Campbell - The Quran and the Bible in the light of Science.

You can start off with this link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdA07nqqszA
(The first minute is a bit of an introduction of the muslim speaker)
Try and look for Dr William Campbell's first debate.

For the other parts of the movie, just copy and paste the title in the search and replace the part no. from part 1 to part 2 etc).

Btw...the Embryology part is a bit boring. Although still astonishing, considering the time of the last revelation.

[CJX]

The most important thing about religion is that you choose it. And the only reason I'm not religious is because I haven't found one that makes sense to me yet.

People find comfort in the belief that 'there is a God' and through this comfort, they are able to live happy lives without a sense of solitude.

And this is the redeeming feature of religion, I think. The happiness certain people can gain from it.

[Seito]

Okay, I'm not going to trawl through all the opinions posted so far and state what I think based on what has been said. It would take far too long and I'm ... well, lazy. But as a religious person myself, I'd like to comment on a couple of things said.

I'd also like to point I'll be speaking from my point of view - that of a Protestant, CoE Christian. So what I say is not for true for all denominations or religions - if you are religious and disagree with what I've said, what I have said is based on my own opinion.

Firstly, the common belief that people are religious blindly, without thinking about it and basing opinion and lifestyle on something they have no proof for. This is simply, not true. We have experienced the 'proof' that we need to believe in it. This can range from all number of things and I won't go into examples, as there are so many. But if anyone wants elaboration, I'm sure I can oblige.
As well as this, we question what we believe daily. It's not a simple ride that we can just accept, as some people seem to think. We have to constantly challenge ourselves and work out what we believe, and why.

Science can accept when it's wrong and move on, whereas religion is stuck somewhere 2000 years ago

Although I can see how this is partially true, it is not as set in stone as that. Take the New Testament for example - it is very adaptable to new societies and eras. It does not so much teach how countries and societies should be run - which could lead to it being less open to change - but how individuals should live. Biblical truths such as "Love your Neighbour" and "Treat others as you'd like to be treated" are valid, whether 100 years from when they were written or 2000.

I can understand why people are religious, but the reasons are selfish. They want to live forever, they want to be part of something bigger than themselves

Okay, this selfish thing has come up for me several times with different people and I just don't get it - if someone who thinks this could explain I'd appreciate it. As I see it, by agreeing to try and live out a Christian (speaking from experience here) life someone is accepting they will have to do some very unselfish things.
And as for living forever - sure, we expect that to be something that happens, but it is not what we want, what we are striving for. What we want is what you said - to be bigger than something then ourselves. For Christians, this is being with God for eternity.

and blowing up themselves and a lot of girls in real-life will ensure they do

Please do not group all religious people with extremists. Almost all religious people are not like this and it's a bit foolish and unreasonable to clump us all into one group like that.

Henceforth the very structure of the major religions has become one of self interest and protectionism.

Erm ... not quite. I can see how you could think that, as the main source of information about the Church for those who aren't part of the Church is stuff such as " The Da vinci Code", but that’s just ... wrong. Crazy as we may seem, we actually do care about all this 'God' stuff and actually want to help each other living the life we try to. And sure, spread what we believe to those who want to learn about it.

But it seems to me that religious practices (as I undertsand it) tend to impliment these beliefs by force-feeding fables and fabricated stories containing morals. ...and... The fables are often sold as truth and therefore it seems the idea is to 'fool' the person in question into holding these values, by scaring it into them...

'Force-feeding' is a bad analogy to use. Yeah, we do tell 'stories' about our beliefs that we hold to be true, but only to those who want to listen. You can't force someone to listen to or accept a belief and so 'force-feeding' isn't quite right.

Also, much could be said for scientific 'fact'. As children in schools, by the media and in life in general, people are told that certain things are 'fact', simply true and thus must be believed. A lot of these 'facts' are based on sketchy evidence at best, but are accepted by the masses for the same reason as people are religious - the need of the human race to understand, to question why. Scientific belief is, at its root, the same as religious belief.
Again, I have an example I can do a little reading on and then base the above paragraph on something, but I'm only going to go into that on specific request.

Sorry for the long post, just wanted to say some things. I'm more than happy for people to disagree - constructive argument is always good so if you're being reasonable don't worry about offending me. Also, if you'd like to ask any questions that you'd rather not post on a public forum, please feel free to PM me.

And also, some of this many not make sense, contain bad spelling and grammar or the like. That’s because I cannot bring myself to work through all of this. If you have … well done.

[CJX]

I can understand why people are religious, but the reasons are selfish. They want to live forever, they want to be part of something bigger than themselves

Okay, this selfish thing has come up for me several times with different people and I just don't get it - if someone who thinks this could explain I'd appreciate it. As I see it, by agreeing to try and live out a Christian (speaking from experience here) life someone is accepting they will have to do some very unselfish things.

The reasons for a person being religious are, at root, selfish. Not their actions.

and blowing up themselves and a lot of girls in real-life will ensure they do

Please do not group all religious people with extremists. Almost all religious people are not like this and it's a bit foolish and unreasonable to clump us all into one group like that.

You misunderstand my point there. I wasn't saying all religious people are extremist, merely listing a few examples of being religious for selfish reasons.

I'm not here to preach Islam to you guys but I just want to say that there is a great misconception that religion and science are incompatible.

There is no religion which agrees completely with science. Religious texts and beliefs can be twisted to agree with science, and scientific proof can be twisted to agree with religion but neither are compatible to any great extent.